Mason Garrett interviews William Stickevers on February 26, 2017.

Mason Garrett:  The post-election stock market rallies continue with both the Dow Jones Industrial Average and the S&P 500 reaching records highs in mid-February thus far.  The question is, how much higher?  With this momentum I’m seeing a probable 21,000 for the Dow Jones and 2400 for the S&P — and then what?

While I have predicted significant stock market drops in the past, they have yet to be the ‘Big One’. I still see a very possible 20 percent or more correction down this year … with stress transits beginning in April-May and then again from August through November. I’ve done charts for April 10th… another possible Black Monday …and the eclipse of August 21, which may have a significant downward effect on the stock markets.
new-moon-april-10th-2017Another tense Full Moon this year occurs on April 10, and that will trigger the Sun-Uranus Conjunction and the Moon-Jupiter Conjunction, and all of that squares brutal Pluto at the focal point of the ongoing T-Square, with a nasty little bundle of Lilith (ruling calamity), Black Moon Lilith (ruling treachery), Comet Lucifer, all conjunct the Vertex in the Fifth House … ruling stock markets, speculations….  Could this be a nasty stock market reversal day?

The Eclipse of August 21 may also be a very significant day in the financial markets.  We have Mercury in the Ninth House, the corporate/government-owned media, in opposition to Neptune in the Third House ruling communications media, at the Medium Coeli.  I see confusion, lies and propaganda with that aspect.  Then we have Jupiter square Pluto, the ongoing political power struggle.  And Pluto is in the Second House of money and value, perhaps a power struggle with the Federal Reserve?


Then we have Venus in the Eighth House of other people’s money, consumers, investors, in square to Uranus … shock, sudden separation from their money, and that in in square to Uranus in the Fifth House, perhaps the sudden shock to the speculative markets?  We shall see.

And now, I’d like to introduce to you a friend of mine and very good mundane astrologer, Mr. William Stickevers.  Financial astrology is one of his specialties.  He is also an IT engineer and he has got charts on everything.  So let’s have a little ‘go-to’ meeting with William.

Hello William!

William Stickevers:  Hello Mason.

MG:  You’ve seen my two charts, the April 10th and the Eclipse of August 21st.  I’m seeing these as very possible changes of direction in the markets, perhaps the big correction that everybody keeps looking for.  We keep hitting these maybe 1,000, 1,500 point drops, and then it rallies, makes it up and keeps right on going.  And we’re in record territory, but I really have uneasy feelings about this market, that it’s out of the blue going to shock everybody, and the question is, when?

WS:  Well, Mason, you bring up some really good points.  There are a lot of astrological mundane signatures that are coming into formation now, combined with the convergence of very perilous secular and financial indicators converging together that indicate we may see a top and destabilization of the markets between now and the end of the year.  And I think everyone knows we’re going to see some kind of correction.  The question is what type of correction, what level of intensity, and is this going to be the ‘big one’, or a prelude of things to come. Would you agree?
barbult-index-2011-2027MG:  Yeah.  Looking back historically to the 1920s and 1930s, the way they set up Hoover to take the fall for the stock market crash.  And I have this intuitive feeling there’s something going on, they’re going to set up Trump to take the blame for whatever happens, they’re doing all they can to interfere with his Presidency,  and trying to figure all that in with the realities of supply and demand, and money manipulation and all of that — who knows?


WS:  Absolutely, I’m in total agreement with that. It’s really clear that Deep State and Wall Street banksters are doing whatever they can to derail the Trump agenda, whose primary job from the outset, from what I can see, is to change the trajectory of the nation.  A radical reconfiguration and change of direction of the government and America’s foreign and domestic policies that have been essentially placating to the oligarchical elite, that essentially has been out-sourcing jobs and deleveraging the middle class for the sake of creating a multi-lateral global trading system, and in the process de-nationalizing countries by creating trade zones and enforcing certain policies where national governments no longer really have any leverage or any say in terms of their future.

MG:  Yes, I totally agree.  There’s so much.

WS:  Now in terms of how this is all coming out with the markets, since that’s what our focus is, and keeping in mind what we just said about the fact that the Deep State is striking back, which is very much tied up with the central banksters, the Wall Street banksters, as well as the general trans-national infrastructure, the people who work and operate at that level throughout the globe, to the counter-globalists movement that we saw with the British Exit Vote, with the Trump unprecedented and unexpected victory.  And now we’re seeing the rise of Marine Le Pen in the French election, and the election going on in the Netherlands and this anti-globalist movement that is spreading throughout the world.

le-pen-election-oddsKeeping all of that in mind and looking at the global economy, we can see that the indicators are showing that we are not only undergoing a political revolution, but a macro-economic reconfiguration and revolution in terms of how we trade, in terms of markets, in terms of price discovery, in terms of all the fundamentals that have defined what economies are based on and what markets are built on, and trade on.  So that’s the bigger thing going on.

And one of the things that you’ve discussed very well in some of your own YouTube presentations and putting some of my material with it, is certainly comparing the recoveries of the total real GDP growth at the end of all the recessions going back to 1961, and you can see that arguably this is the weakest recessionary recovery, and I think we can argue that there was really no recovery, but really a cover-up.

MG:  Yes, it is.

WS:  And this is essentially played out and pontificated by the former Obama Administration for the past eight years, they have been essentially negligent in letting the globalists’ doctrine and policies supersede domestic economic policy and global economic policy for the United States, while at the same time the Federal Reserve in conjunction with the Obama Administration were announcing rosy job numbers, skewing the numbers, skewing the facts and statistics, essentially putting out fake news, fake economic data.  So the fake news that we’re witnessing now on the political end, really all begin around 2009 when Obama announced in June that the Great Recession had ended, the Recovery was in progress, and the Green Shoots economy — this new economy that his administration designed in concert with the Fed policies would bring the middle class back to where it was prior to his election, which never occurred.

Now we’ve reached a point where we’re seeing a major middle class revolt.  Trump’s election is essentially a revolt by the de-leveraged middle class that has lost all hope, that has been demoralized because the government has been negligent in its social contract, and as this has been playing out, the dysfunction of the economy continues to accelerate and intensify.  And it’s clear that we have not only entered into the early stages of another recession, but that this recession is a prelude to a likely greater depression that is not only going to be centralized here in the United States but throughout the globe.


And that image here about the economy where Obama is on the USS Titanic and he says, “It’s not sinking, it’s just a downward revision.” It really exemplifies what you and I have been discussing for many months about how this cover-up has been a massive intelligence operation by the oligarchical Wall Street central bankster elite.

MG:  Um Hmm.  Lately, this crazy talk has come to my mind, many mundane astrologers and establishment people keep talking about the Fall of the Roman Empire and equating that with the possible fall of the United States Empire.  Suddenly I’m looking at the bigger picture here, it’s not maybe so much the Fall of the Roman Empire, the American Empire, we may be looking at in the very near future, the fall of the Global Empire that’s created this mess.  We have the Trump Revolution here, Brexit, Le Pen and all these other people.  It’s like the fall is coming, but it’s a bigger fall and it’s not just the Fall of the Roman Empire, but it’s the fall of this whole worldwide mess.  It’s as if the oligarchy has created a worldwide Roman Empire that is now way overextended in all categories.  People are crying for their original culture, countries, sovereignty to be re-established.  Whether or not they will be, we don’t know.  But it’s bigger than we think, this fall.  And it’s not just the United States, it’s global.

WS:  I think we’re going through a major transformational period, which is part of a psycho-spiritual death-rebirth process, where the belief in the system, its social institutions, the governments that are based on the social and legal contracts begin to break down.  This is the first phase.  So we’re seeing the process of decay and death, that will follow with a transition to a transformation event which we would call in historical terms an “X Event”.  They generally occur in the second decade of every first century.  An ‘X Event’ then indicates the transition from the death to the transformation, followed by a rebirth or what historians like to call a Renaissance.

So the United States and the global oligarchical elite that basically took control from 1945 onwards, which many historians call the ‘Pax Americana Period’ (from 1945 to current) is collapsing on its own weight.  It built a system that’s not sustainable or tenable, it pontificates nationalism but it really is based on transnational global governance principles.  It goes entirely against democracy, it goes entirely against libertarian democratic values, and it operates invisibly.

What a lot of astrologers out there still aren’t seeing is that the political revolutions that are taking place (and Trump’s election should be the sign), are not an aberration, or because the Russians ‘rigged the elections’ – that’s what the neo-liberal astrology faction that makes up 90 percent of the astrologers today – they are pontificating that same CNN shrill statement that the election was rigged by the Russians, and that’s why Trump won.  No.  Trump won because we saw a collapse of the middle class, and there were economic indicators that go back during the last several years that show we have shifted into not only a recessionary mode, but a severe recessionary to depression mode.  We’re seeing that with tax receipts which indicate that since 2013 we have been in a recession.  The gross private domestic investment indicates we are in a recession.  Retail is collapsing all over the place and that’s showing that the U.S. consumer is tapped out.  And that’s important because this whole globalist model is based on consumption, not innovation and manufacturing, and the election of Trump is the strike-back from the middle class to the oligarchical elite, and it’s happening worldwide now.

Trumpzilla | William Stickevers, Astrologer | Astrology and Politics

So Trump is the leader who’s going to attempt to sacrifice the Empire – the transnational American globalist empire – in order to restore the nation, in order to bring the country back to normalcy, in order for it to operate under a Constitutional framework again, in order for it to be the country that it became; a self-sufficient, self-reliant, technological, economic, cultural, industrial super power.  Which it no longer is, it’s just so on paper.  So that’s really what he’s doing and the economy is the greatest argument he has and leverage mechanism which will give him the green light by the middle class to do whatever it takes to restore it back to what it once was.

MG:  — Right.  I see the whole ________illa that we’re living in right now.  So many people are getting sucked into paranoia and fears, and spinning of the illusions of Neptune.  And when people get locked under that influence for whatever reason they may choose, one side or the other, it’s not based on reality and we have this back-and-forth that we’re witnessing in the media cycles.  And really, I see the direction right now, is that every individual needs to hook onto not Neptune, but  Uranus.  Uranus is change.  And the forces of Pluto in that square are willy-nilly in bringing those changes about.  But in our meditations (if we meditate), it’s the influence of Uranus, the new, the revolutionary, the breaking into these fantastic potentials that are just around the corner with some of these technologies, the genetics, and biological field, all kinds of things.  I think in 2020 at the winter solstice when we finally get that next Jupiter-Saturn great chronocrator when it shifts out of the earth signs into the air signs — that 20-year Jupiter-Saturn conjunction that is always a major forge?____-struck now going into air signs, as our colleague, Richard Nolle says, “It’s like handing an I-Pad to an 1840s farmer.  These things that are literally just a few years down the road are beyond our comprehension.

Like Trump and Le Pen, quit looking at them as ‘little people.’  These are destiny figures.  They are simply representing these forces.  So don’t be scared, get into Uranus and get into this revolution of thinking and bringing back to the original –

WS:  Vision of the Founding Fathers, right?

MG: Yeah.

WS:  That’s an excellent point because one of the things that made America great was its ability to innovate, and produce its way through innovation, through the greatest economy, the greatest military, the greatest scientific complex in the world.  We have achieved more in a hundred years than empires have in a thousand years.  You look at all the level of innovation and patents, and inventors.  Who sets the operating system standard?  Who sets the standards worldwide?  It’s been the United States since 1900 on.  We did the first in almost everything, and if we weren’t the first we became number one in that particular area once we committed to it 100 percent through the type of system that the Founding Fathers put in place.

And that has been superseded by this oligarchical elite that wants to destroy the middle class.  Because it’s only through the destruction of the middle class — de-leveraging it where they have no protections, they have no social security, they have no economic security — is the only way they can implement the last phase of this global re-set to move us into a transnational shift into a globalized world government.  A globalized system with global governance and one digital-base currency, etc.  So all of this is only one part of what’s going on.


At any rate, I want to get back to the stock markets because we’ve been seeing so many different bellwether indicators that are dramatically lower in 2017 than they’ve ever been since the Recession officially ended in 2009.  One of the indicators is the largest percentage of decline in average weekly work-hours since the Recession in 2008; we’ve now surpassed that level.  Meaning there are people, contractual workers that make up a majority now, not employed workers but underemployed or contractual employed workers, working less weekly hours than they were in 2008.  The job growth at the S&P 500 companies, that essentially set the standard for American companies and which most pensions have their equities investments in, has gone negative for the first time since 2008.  Meaning the companies are making more money because they’re buying back more stock, but in terms of growth, in terms of expanding their employee base — that has gone net negative.  And the U.S. economy, keep in mind, has grown at a dismal 1.9 percent annual rate on a consistent basis since 2009.  It has never hit past 2 percent.  And now it’s down to 1.9 percent during the fourth quarter of 2016 and DECLINING.  So what’s happening here is the markets are moving up, but the Gross Domestic Product, and all the other economic bellwethers are moving dramatically lower at the same time.


MG:  Right.  We’re not making widgets anymore.  Yesterday I was out in the low desert called San Jacinto, and driving through an area on the outskirts there are acres and acres that are owned by Ron Hubbard of Scientology, and they have a studio out there.  And many of the buildings are boarded-up, it didn’t look like any human activity at all.  And yet you see their promotions that they’re this thriving world-wide organization, and when you drive through that area, they’re not.  And I see the same thing going on all over.  It’s this illusion of “great money and yada yada” and it’s not.  When I finally retired, I was doing technical work in a _______ studios, transferring tapes and making cd’s.  And after several management changes they ended up laying off 50 percent of the people.  And the rest of us ended up working 12-hour shifts.  And you think, “How are they saving any money on that, with all of the overtime?”  Well they can’t afford to pay the medical and Workman’s Comp and all of the things that the insanity of the past eight years has brought about.

WS:  You’re basically telling me that they can no longer sustain an employment force, a true middle class employment force where you get compensation, a proper salary for 40 hours work, medical, retirement and other benefits that are part of your work contract for your commitment to that company and its vision.  Am I correct in what you’re saying?

MG:  Right.  From the 1950s to the 1990s which was our great heyday.  And now that’s gone and we’re not making widgets anymore.  Not exporting.


WS:  Right.  And this is a good point because you came up at a time (you’re a little older than me, although you’re still young) when the country was expanding, developing, progress, innovation, experimentation, investment in infrastructure, manufacturing, development really proliferated and it was a time when America was at its best.  Now we’re in a period of de-leveraging.  Instead of innovating, we’re out-sourcing.  Instead of building infrastructure, we’re no longer investing.  The country basically had a scalable, robust, informed, highly skilled workforce at all different levels; manufacturing, service, and consumption level work force as well.  That no longer can exist today.  Since 1992 with the beginning of NAFTA was not only the out-sourcing of jobs, but the complete disintegration of those very things that created the America that the Baby Boomers grew up on, and today results in a 73 percent consumption economy.  I’m sure that when you were born, Mason, the economy was around 69-70 percent manufacturing and now it’s 73-72 percent consumption.  So we have a 72 percent consumption economy in 2016, and when you were coming of age it was somewhere between 50 and 70 percent of manufacturing.  So that’s the real difference, that is what Americans forget about.

Not to mention the fact that the money was backed by gold.  The dollar was backed by gold, held an intrinsic value of gold, a means of production to acquire and hold that gold.  There were basic fundamentals at work.  And because those fundamentals were sound, more or less, with only intermediate or necessary intervention on the part of government due to the Great Depression, the markets were basically free markets and reflected what was actually happening in terms of change and innovation.  They were always a leading indicator of where things were going.  That is no longer true today.  Since 2009 we’ve been living in the ‘Extend and Pretend’ era of economics, of trade, or price discovery – everything that we now know about markets and almost every aspect of it is fraudulent, is gross fraud on a level we have never seen since the collapse of the Roman Empire.  This is what we’re facing now.


Now that we’re at this point I definitely want to talk about the S&P 500 Index and explain how we’re going to see the beginning of the end of the ‘Extend and Pretend’ that was pushed through by the Fed policies, and pontificated by Barack Obama whose negligent stewardship of the economy has resulted in what we’re seeing now; where the elite, the one percent continue to make money and thrive while the middle class is barely able to survive.

MG:  Yes, the only job they can get is to be Soros-paid protestors.  A paying job there.S&P 500 INDEX FIRST TRADE HOROSCOPE

WS:  Let’s look at the S&P 500Index.  March 4, 1957, 10:00 am on Wall Street, this is when the Index was conceived by S&P Company.  As you can see we have the Sun in Pisces, we have the Moon in Aries, and we have Gemini on the Ascendant, and an Aquarius Midheaven.  Notice too that we have Saturn in Sagittarius as well.  That’s important because right now transiting Saturn is in Sagittarius.



If we look at the transits and what has happened recently, the S&P went through its second Saturn Return.  And Saturn is going to be retrograding and coming within striking distance again to that Saturn.  While that Saturn Return was taking place, we had the Neptune-Saturn Square ongoing through 2014, 2015, into 2016, and now Saturn is finally moving ahead of Neptune.  What that generally means is the Saturn-Neptune is about extending and pretending.  That’s keeping interest rates at an artificially low rate of one percent or negative in other countries outside the U.S., because remember Neptune has to do with credit, soft money.  People live on credit, they don’t really live on their salaries, they don’t have hard cash today, and that also applies to the United States.  So there’s the extending and pretending principle of Saturn-Neptune which has to do with creating money out of thin air, infusing it into insolvent financial institutions, borrowing, buying back, creating debt from that, and selling that debt as bonds in order to keep the stock markets and the equities markets and the general consumption-based economy going; extending the façade that the economy has reached normalcy and has recovered.  And you can see that with Neptune on the Sun of the S&P 500.  Basically the inflation and stock run-up we have witnessed, is essentially all due to this Neptune-Sun configuration that has been inflating the markets while we’ve seen the economic fundamentals continue to degrade.


MG:  I totally agree.  Reckoning is due.

WS:  So one of the reasons I think you wanted me on today, Mason, was to talk about how the era of ‘Extend and Pretend’ is coming to an end.

MG:  Right, absolutely.


WS:  And this has to do with this Jupiter-Uranus-Pluto T-Square configuration that is now in place.  Because we have to remember, let’s say from late 2014 through today we’ve had this massive S&P run-up, it’s gone from anabolic to parabolic levels and that has to do with the liquidity, the market manipulations that have been going on, the stock buy-backs by corporations since it’s easier for them to borrow money and buy back their own stock, and pay it off at almost virtually no interest immediately as their equity prices rise, and as a result, give the illusion — the impression that their companies are growing while they’re laying off workers, like you stated earlier, many of them don’t have real middle class jobs where they can have a mortgage, send their kids to college, where their wife doesn’t have to work another job, medical benefits are out the window, their retirement is completely gone or becomes marginalized.  Now we have the Uranus-Jupiter alignment, especially with the Jupiter-Pluto alignment hitting the S&P dead-on on March 30, 2017.

MG:  That makes my chart forecast  look pretty good.
WS:  That’s right.  And if we look at the Blackbox indicators – this is a weighing system, and we can apply this to anyone’s chart, it doesn’t just apply to financial instruments or first trade horoscopes, but it can apply to anything and we’re applying it now to the S&P 500.  We have 2017 here and we see this green area indicates bullish indicators, and the red area indicates bearish indicators.  We can see this big run-up in January, around the time that Trump got inaugurated.  Everyone was saying, “The market’s going to crash as soon as Trump gets in.”  Nope, it went up higher.  We still see it remaining strong and we see the market making another high in early March.  And it will probably hold its own or remain within a particular price range all the way through this period until the Jupiter-Pluto alignment comes in play, and that’s around this period here in the graph, this bearish indicator.


But here’s the thing, a lot of astrologers will say, “On the day of the Jupiter-Pluto Square on March 30, that means that the market will crash.”  No, that’s not how it works, folks. That’s why we use this Blackbox, because it indicates not just one testimony, but over 780 testimonies compounded on top of that one testimony, averaging out the scoring and the weighing and adjusting it, and also adjusting for lag factors, so just because something happens on a particular day doesn’t mean it happens immediately.

Looking at that we can see the beginning of volatility, and bearish astrological indicators begin to hit the S&P 500 chart very hard.  One of the indicators is the Solar Arc Ascendant conjuncts Uranus, and as you know, Mason, Uranus has to do with volatility and instability; it’s not an indicator where a ‘buy and hold’ strategy works.

MG:  No.

WS:  Generally if people have been going long on the market, they begin to go short on the market.  So they may still be invested in the S&P during this period, but the smart money is going to start shorting or pulling their money out faster.  There’s going to be a need to go into wealth preservation mode.  The rumors on the street are going to be real.  This period in April, for nothing else, indicates when the ‘Extend and Pretend’ period of the Barack Obama economics of liquidity, and zero interest rates, and manipulation of the markets that has resulted in the second-largest bull run in the history of the stock market begins to unwind.

MG:  Yep.  April Fool!

WS:  I’m looking at a few things here because it’s clear a lot of people feel that the equity markets refuse to come down, and the S&P has even closed above many forecasters’ trend lines.  But again, I’m looking at at least a 10 percent correction, possibly a 20 percent warning correction, it can go anywhere between 10 to 20 percent on this one, maybe somewhere in the middle.  But I’m seeing a correction around that place within this time-frame here beginning in late March, although we may see another high, it just means some volatility.  And then we see a 10 percent correction, but not a complete collapse of the market as many people are forecasting.

MG:  There wasn’t a complete collapse in 1929, it was for a few months and then there was a rally that recovered about 50 percent and there were other downturns after that, that finally bottomed out in the 30s.  That’s what I see.  In March, April will be that first ‘bang’ shot.  And then there will be recovery, however much it goes down.  The technical charting guys, you know, speak of the classic 50 percent recovery of whatever the drop.  And then a key date: the Big Kahuna eclipse this year that slices right across the middle of the country in August (21), that’s the one that I think will lead to whatever point where it bottoms out and just completely, perhaps, wipes out all of this Neptune illusion that we’ve been living with for the past couple of decades.

And then that’s the time to go for Uranus, and go for these new evolutionary solutions, from April to August.

WS:  I totally agree.  What we’re seeing here is a warning shot or a ‘shot over the bow’ as they would say from a military standpoint.  Where a warning shot is fired over the bow of another ship, indicating to the smart money that the era or policy of ‘Extend and Pretend’ is over.  And probably – and this is using a little of intuition here, because I look at Trump’s chart and his transits, I look at all of the other transits going on, I look at all the indicators using the Multibox Financial Forecast so I can look at every particular commodity fund, instrument and market.  What we’re seeing here is probably at around the time that Trump begins to roll out his legislation to make dramatic changes to economic policy, to impose tariffs that are long overdue, to essentially break the back of the trade deals and transnational corporate policies that have been pushed through over the past eight years.


And let me say this for those who think I’m just beating-up Barack Obama, I am well aware – I think Mason and I are both on the same page when we realize that NAFTA was created by George Bush and got approved and pushed through by Bill Clinton, and then got accelerated and intensified with George W. Bush’s election resulting in the scenario we have today, and then was pacified with the ‘Extend and Pretend’ policies of Obama, it’s all part of a bigger thing.  So I’m not just beating-up on Obama.  I do hold these transnational, oligarchical ciphers responsible, and it’s not just them, it’s the people at all levels of government.

the-end-of-extend-adn-pretendBut what we’re really saying, and what I’m seeing here, is that when Trump puts in his policy to reverse this globalist agenda to marginalize our economy, marginalize our intelligence operations, marginalize the people, marginalize our workforce, to do everything it takes in order to present a crisis where a transnational, centralized globalist model will be presented as a solution and enforced through the UN that is superseding our federal government, will be interrupted and obstructed through the period that we’re talking about here.  I believe that’s when Trump will come through.  And part of what he’s going to represent will be destabilizing to the “Extend and Pretend” markets.  Not the real markets – not the true markets based on the fundamentals of true price discovery, and free exchange, but based on these fake models that YOU out there continue to invest your money in.  With that money you give to your broker, that money you give to your Roth IRA every month, expecting to get that $1 million to $2 million retirement from – that’s NEVER going to happen.  So that’s really the issue that’s going on here.

MG:  I totally agree, William.

WS:  Based on the Multi-Black Box we’re seeing the S&P 400 mid-cap, the S&P 500 really getting stressed all throughout the first half of this year, most noticeably in April.  We’re starting to see it now with the mid-caps which are better leading indicators than the large cap.  So when I see the S&P 400 mid-cap being stressed earlier, followed by the S&P 500 at a later period being stressed, that tells me that we’re going to see an unwinding in the markets and a loss of confidence.


But notice here, where we look at the gold trading, where the COMEX is, we notice that’s very red as well.  What that means, when gold is red, is that’s when people buy gold.  Because red is bearish indicators, and green is bullish.  What I’ve noticed is when gold gets stressed, that’s when people buy gold.  When gold is green, you see the price essentially trade within its normal range, it stays steady with no major ups or downs.  But when it gets red (and people sometimes sell off their gold because they feel confident about the markets and they’ll buy other instruments such as equities) but when it gets red, and I see it getting redder during this period here, that means people will start acquiring gold as a hedge against destabilizing or volatile markets, especially in equities.

But it won’t be one big, one-shot equity unwind, “OMG, what’ll I do, have I lost my retirement, should I sell now?”  It will be a warning shot with a lot of volatility and a lot of damage control by the Feds, by the institutions saying, “Don’t worry, this is normal, we knew this was coming, your money is safe, don’t sell anything.”  You’re going to hear a lot of that, and meanwhile the smart money, WHILE THEY’RE TELLING YOU THAT, the smart money’s going to be buying that gold.  There’s going to be a lot of that going on.

So this is what I’m trying to say, we’re going to be seeing a lot of volatility and what they say versus what they do, there’s going to be a vast difference.

MG:  I see a similar thing with gold.  As my viewers know, my therapeutic hobby is salvage.  I have a little shed in the backyard and I tear apart old televisions, vacuum cleaners, computers, whatever.  It’s pennies, but for me it’s therapy.  Mars rules iron and tools, and salvage is ruled by Pluto, so it’s the perfect therapeutic outlet to express energies.  And I managed to latch onto some old computers and I’ve had some good luck lately recovering gold-plated little pins.  And when I go to the scrapyard to cash-in my copper and aluminum, I can see the real market at the junkyard because their prices fluctuate as well.  And when I’m getting $3 a pound for copper at the yard, that is a realistic – that’s not intellectual paper nonsense — that’s what the price will support for the profit of the scrapyard dealer and myself.  And I see with this gold the same thing.  Now you don’t buy gold at the scrapyard, you go someplace else.  But to me it doesn’t matter.  Because if I pick up an old computer out of the trash my overhead is just the effort of taking it home.  So I’m going to keep my eye on these salvage prices and how they support reality far more than all this equity stuff.

WS:  I think that’s important because what you’re basically saying is that the spot price on precious metals is vastly different than what it is in terms of paper if gold ETF is at $12.43 which is basically around the target price of gold that many investors are looking at right now. But the reality is that if you try and buy an ounce of gold for $12.43 they will laugh at you.  The spot price of gold is more like $2,100, $2,200.  And then try and get delivery the next day.  Even if you have $2,300 cash and say, “Here it is, give me my ounce of gold”, it isn’t going to happen.  Because there’s somewhere between two to six weeks of delays on deliveries simply because the demand continues to increase exponentially WORLDWIDE.

That is another thing the astrologers, the media, the ‘Extend and Pretend’ financial mainstream legacy media refuse to tell you, and the astrologers are buying into the fact that: “gold is something we shouldn’t even consider here.”

And another thing I want to bring up here now that we’re talking about gold.  If you had invested money in gold in 1999 or 2005, or 2010 — if you took the same amount of money and put it into gold in any one of those periods versus the stock market you would have gained more money than if you had invested it in the S&P 500, you would have more money than if you had invested it in the Dow.  What does that tell you?

MG:  Right.


WS:  That means that the dollar is devaluing, that means we’re in an inflationary cycle.  That means that when you subtract the inflation and additional costs after you cash out on your stocks, you’re net negative compared to gold.  So that is something again a lot of people overlook.  I do a Depression Defense Consultation that just focuses on this for people by the way.  And I show them their numbers.  I say, well if you cashed out today versus if you did this.  So do you want to keep totally invested in stocks and don’t want to have any money in precious metals because your broker can’t make any money from that?  And they see what I’m saying.

MG:  Here’s another confirmation.  The scrappers have a lot of YouTube videos, it’s a definite category.  And this one fellow shared something that he did. When you recover the little gold-plated pins from a computer, they’re not solid gold, just plated.  Underneath will be nickel, perhaps silver, even iron.  They’re just plated.  This individual collected a couple of pounds of these gold-plated pins and plugs, and instead of separating the gold and silver and other metals, he simply took a torch and melted them all into little one-ounce bars.  He sold these mixed bars on EBay which are some gold, some silver, some nickel all together.  And the people who buy the raw commodity will do the assay and give you the gold content.

On Ebay he sold that little one-ounce bar for $250 cash.

WS:  Absolutely.  And that supports what I stated earlier and what we’ve been talking about for weeks in our discussions prior to this presentation we’re doing.  So precious metals are going to move up.  I do see some minor correction with precious metals between now and this spring.  So people will call and say, “Gold went down or silver went down a little.”  I’m certainly expecting that, but it won’t be that much of a correction.  Because what we’re going to see is when gold begins to move it will move up big, and then silver soon follows.  It’s gold first, then silver.  Let’s look at the silver COMEX price.  We don’t see so many moves on silver this year, I believe that happens in the second half of this year or next year.  So I’m seeing much more movement on gold.

But you have to keep in mind that if the price of gold goes to $13.25, the spot price to buy the metal, the trade-in — if you say to the COMEX, “I want to sell my paper gold and swap it for gold,” they will say, “No, we’ll give you cash, but we’re not going to give you metal.” And people have talked about this for years now, especially since the 2009 financial crisis.  They basically say you cannot get gold from the COMEX or from these exchange places because they don’t have it.  They don’t have it because too many people are buying it, like you, Mason.

MG:  Right.  Or they’re throwing it away in the trash and don’t even know it.

WS:  Right.  So folks what we’re trying to get at here and get to you and help you understand, is that black is white, and white is black.  We’re looking through the looking glass.  Nothing appears as it truly is.  We are in the last phase of ‘Extend and Pretend’ especially when it comes to equities markets, because Neptune is still sitting on that S&P 500 and that indicates a dissolution or dissolving of the fundamentals that drive the market.  And the ONLY thing keeping that market going is the day-to-day manipulated emotional sentiment generated by legacy financial mainstream media, that people continue to believe in.  Meanwhile the smart money, very soon if not already, has begun selling assets off, selling equities off, and moving into much more sound instruments of various types and especially the precious metals.


We’re going to see a lot of instability, we’re going to see people questioning.  This is the beginning and we could do another show in the future on this, Mason.  We are seeing the beginning of the Pension Tsunami.  The Jupiter-Uranus-Pluto T-Square indicates it’s the implosion, breakdown and revelation that the pensions are insolvent simply because the ‘Extend and Pretend’ game that they pulled basically stole, intrinsically took away, from the only remaining asset base that was left after the 2009 financial debacle, financial crisis, and that was the pensions.  So the pensions are in trouble and many of the Baby Boomers and Silent Generation folks who think that they’re going to get their pensions as they’re getting them now don’t realize what’s about to come.

MG:  Yup.  I’m in the process of doing more drawings for my therapeutic drawing books and looking for ways to equal my social security check. I don’t know how much longer it’s going to be there.

WS:  Well Mason, you’re a world class astrologer, you’re skilled in many areas, you’ve seen and done it all, you have a lot of expertise and spiritual understanding that’s much broader than most Americans and even most of the astrologers out there, I’m not so worried about you.  What I am worried about is the folks that continue to listen to what’s being pontificated to them including many of the astrologers that continue to essentially just become shills of not just what’s being pontificated on CNN, but what’s being pontificated in the Wall Street Journal.  This is where the real crisis is, is that many people are just completely fooled and beguiled by what has been taking place and continue to view everything as a disruption to the fake world — like the rise of Trump and all of these other geopolitical developments — as a disruption of their unsustainable world view.

MG:  Right.  You cannot use astrology to validate your bias, it’s going to trip you up.  It’s good for learning and research to do historical charts, that’s how we all learn.  But the pitfall is, it’s always easier to read charts after the fact.  There are enough stars, fixed stars, asteroids, comets that will verify any kind of prediction you want to make. It’s very complex.  Okay, I’m an old timer, I try to base most of my systems on the basic nine planets. Sometimes I’ll throw in a fixed star like Algol, that’s a really nasty bugger, but we’ve got to put our bias aside and look at overall forces that are at work here and now.  Because that is what’s going to bring about whatever comes down the pike.  And if the asteroids and stars coincide, that’s the icing on the cake.

And remember that all of this CNN and media stuff, that’s all Neptune.  And Neptune is a very beautiful planet.  Every planet, every aspect has got a positive and negative side.  Spiritually Neptune opens up all kinds of things, and creatively all sorts of things.  But when it comes down to reality — uh uh.  It’s going to fool you every time, and especially when it’s in the sign that it rules.  And the old ruler, Jupiter, being in a stressful aspect to Uranus – oh no.  There are going to be some big changes.  I’ll just leave it at that.

We’ve had a really good rap today, William.

WS:  Well I think so, I want to thank you for allowing me to come on your show.  I really appreciate the opportunity you’re giving me and I’m really looking forward to the feedback from your listeners, your clients, and the people that follow you.  I really have to commend you.  Many people in your age group are just keeping quiet.  The older astrologers say to me, “William I hear what you’re saying, but as long as I’m getting my pension, I’m not going to say much on this because that’s all I’m really concerned about it.”  And the problem with that, is it skews their understanding, their openness, their ability to understand what the transits are saying.  And the very thing that they’re holding on for dear life for, and basing their whole entire future on is false, unsustainable, untenable, and that’s exactly what this Neptune here is showing.

And just keep in mind, that Neptune rules credit.  What have they been doing?  Creating false credit and pushing it into these institutions, and creating the false belief that the economy, based on the S&P 500 or based on the stock market (which is the smaller stock market by the way) …  The smallest market is the equities market. It’s very small and unsophisticated compared to the bond market which is twice the size, the currency markets which is ten times the size, and the derivatives markets which is a million times the size.

So a lot of the older astrologers out there (with the exception of you, Mason, and a few others) are calling it as they see it, even though they are benefiting one way or another from that pension system or social security, or whatever subsidization they’re getting in retirement.   But you are realizing that the jig is up and it has nothing to do with the generation who contributed to the system, but it has to do with the corruption (Neptune), corrupt leadership (Neptune) that has created this coming debacle.

MG:  Yep.  They should have stuck to making movies.  It really is all about Neptune, it’s just a movie.

WS:  Ultimately, yes, we know it’s just a movie, but unfortunately a lot of people are going to have to deal with this.  We’re all going to get hit by it, not just the Baby Boomers or Silent Generation, or few GI Generation folks still alive.  It’s going to hit everybody and hurt everybody.  The equities market is the most sensitive but least sophisticated, and it’s the smallest market.  So when you begin to see the equities unravel, that’s the indication that the debt market (which is the bond market) will begin to unravel which is twice the size of the equities market.  And when that happens the central bank is going to have to do things in order to maintain it, and yet if they do, they are setting themselves up to default at some point.

So the real power struggle here between Trump and the Deep State – and when I mention the Deep State I’m talking the financial deep state, the shadow banking system, the national security structure, the breakaway civilization – that whole cabal is going to be the confrontation, and the power struggle is deciding do we keep the country?  Or do we decide to sacrifice the country for empire?  And that all is coming to a theater near you starting this spring.  What you’ve seen is nothing.  What you’ve seen is just an aftermath of post-election drama, which really doesn’t add up to anything in comparison to where we’re going to be moving, come this spring.

MG:  Alright.  I always remind people that there are archaeologists today, and I have a deep respect for archaeologists who spend their lives digging up lost high tech civilizations, hundreds of thousands, millions of years, who knows how many years old?  And nobody yet has conquered the entire globe.  That is a big Neptune fantasy.  And in my personal belief, I don’t think anybody is ever going to rule the world.  It’s just a fantasy, a mental disorder that persists throughout history.  It never works. And back again, we’re right around the corner from all that illusion crashing.  Again, I try and encourage people to look at the news (even though it’s controlled).  When a bad tornado rips through the South or the Midwest and you see all this wreckage … oh my god.   And in a year or two it’s all put back.  Hmm?  So yeah, all of this corruption is going to collapse into a steaming, smoking mess.

WS:  I agree with what you’re saying, but I want to put hope out there to your listeners and to all people who have an interest in this.  The collapse will be followed by a reformation, a reconstruction, a re-engineering of the country and of the global economy followed by a renaissance.  But there will be blood in the streets before that happens.  The astrologers have to get with the program and realize what is coming here.  When the era of ‘Extend and Pretend’ comes to an end, we’re going to realize how we were all gypped or blindsided by the measures put into place to keep the markets going after the dot com collapse.  All of the manipulations by putting the money into false instruments to prop-up the real estate markets, which then collapsed and almost caused a derivatives unwind, which required a liquidity rescue of creating money out of thin air and injecting it into institutions and governments worldwide.

I mean folks, c’mon, let’s get with the program here.  The Federal Reserve injected $17 trillion within a three-week period starting March 24, 2007.  That information wasn’t released until 2009, 2010, and that’s not including all the other measures: the $800 billion bail-out by George W. Bush, followed by a bank bail-out in February of 2009 by Barack Obama.  Had they not put that $17 trillion injection not only into the markets, but into other countries and corporations and that list remains secret, by the way.  This is all out there.  You can look this up yourself.  This is the ‘Extend and Pretend’ that had to be put in place.  And the damage control is wearing off (Neptune), and things as they truly are are going to be exposed.  So this is the end, and we’re going to see this Neptune on the Sun of the S&P 500 indicates the dissolution and disintegration of the false manipulations on the part of the Wall Street elite and the Fed, and by the U.S. government to maintain the false belief that the economy is growing.  So that is what we all need to be concerned about.

And Trump, who is well aware of this, is going to do whatever it takes to attempt to fundamentally re-engineer the American economy to build markets, to restructure the markets that are based on true price discovery.  He will attempt to do it.  Whether he’s successful or not depends on many things, and it’s not a sure thing.  But nevertheless, this is where we are heading.

And I think the next thing we should talk about in another segment in the future is going to the largest pension fund first trade horoscopes, look at them with the Blackbox, talk about them.  Inform the Baby Boomers, the Silent Generation, and the GI folks who are still around, who realize what is coming.  This is not just going to be a Generation X or Millennial crisis, this is going to be hitting all of the generations simultaneously.

MG:  Yep.  Well we’ll certainly do that, William.  And for you folks out there, William is an Aries, and I have an Aries Moon, which means we’re going to be in your face about it.

Well William, it’s been terrific, so we’ll wrap this up now.  Thanks a bunch, it’s really been informative, really great information.  So we’ll see you all next time.







  1. Wow, thanks for that William and Mason. Your knowledge leaves me in awe. I just wonder how all this is going to play out here in South Africa, but will be jubilant when this corruption comes to a screaming halt. I too am into astrology although the two of you intimidate me. Can you believe it from an Aquarius sun and Aries moon!!!

  2. CryptoReporter

    Tough to read, thank you. I personally trade bitcoin and its going parabolic again on the weekly charts, which means at some point its going to have to come down. We’ll see. Im surprised not to see gold moving up again with all the “extend and pretend”, but we are seeing higher volume of gold transactions. On the monthly gold charts (long term charts) I am seeing the tenkan and kinjun lines cross over to a slight bullish signal a few months back using the ichimoku technical indicator. Its an early indication gold has plans to go higher. The chinkou lagging line is also trying to cross through candlestick price, yet another early sign of an uptrend in gold price. If price moves up to $1400 gold would have plenty of uptrend signals especially if it moves above the kumo cloud. This could easily happen if April turns disastrous for the stock market.

  3. Pingback: Alfred Webre ~ 03/05/17 ~ Sacred Matrix ~ Revolution Radio ~ Hosts Janet Kira & Dr. Sasha Lessin – Aquarian Radio

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